Music Guru Rick Rubin On "People I (Mostly Admire)" Podcast Doesn't Talk Music. Huh?

 Steven Levitt, who has a Ph.D. in Economics from MIT, may be one of the most monotone, droning, low-energy interviewers in podcasting. His voice could double as an ASMR trigger. 

Yet, Levitt is arguably one of the best interviewers in podcasting. 

Crazy but true.

While Levitt's voice has that computerized "Do you want to hear your checking balance" quality, his questions are deeply personal and probe the essence of Rick Rubin's creative process, as they do for every guest on his podcast.

Just in case you've never listened to music before, Rick Rubin is the co-founder (alongside Russell Simmons) of Def Jam Recordings, founder of American Recordings, and former co-president of Columbia Records. 

Rubin's genius has transcended musical genres, and during his career he has worked in a multiplicity of genres, from hip hop to country.

Rubin helped popularize hip hop by producing records for acts such as the Beastie Boys, Run-DMC, Public Enemy, and LL Cool J. He has also produced hit records for acts in other genres, such as heavy metal (Metallica, Slayer), alternative rock ( Red Hot Chili Peppers, the Strokes and Weezer), hard rock (Aerosmith), nu-metal (Linkin Park, Rage Against the Machine, System of a Down), and country (Johnny Cash and the Chicks).

In 2007, Rubin was called "the most important producer of the last 20 years" by MTV and was named on Time's list of the "100 Most Influential People in the World."

In the newest episode of People I (Mostly) Admire, a podcast on the Freakonomics Radio Network, host Steven Levitt talks to Rick Rubin.

The conversation differs from the other interviews Rubin has done recently because his interrogator is not a musician or music journalist. Levitt does not, by his own admission, know much about music. He is an economist, and coming at the conversation from that end opens different lines of conversation.

At one point, they discuss the advantages of being "the dumbest person in the room." Levitt talks about his PhD work at MIT as one of the worst-performing students in the class, and how rather than frustrating him, he found it liberating. 

Rubin compares that to how he produces. "There's something about that childlike state," he says, then continues:

"It's the way the creative process works. We're not good at what we do because we know more. We're trying to get back to the state that you described when you felt like you were the dumbest one in the room, and you're trying to make sense of things that don't make sense and you're in wonder and awe about the world. That's the greatest place to be creating from. That's where creation comes from. When you know more, you know what's impossible. Knowing what's impossible doesn't help you do the impossible. You have to believe in something that's impossible to allow it to come into existence."

 Check out People I (Mostly) Admire and be prepared for, what Monty Python exclaims is, "Something completely different."