Grave Matters Season Two: Bodies, Zombies, Crime Scenes & Rituals

  I must admit that the Australian podcast Grave Matters: a lively look at death has discovered a niche that is not flooded with thousands of similar podcasts covering the same or a similar topic.

The podcast covers death, hence the name Grave Matters. Typically, podcasters -- network and indie -- seem to steer away from discussions of death. You know -- The Grim Reaper, the dirt nap, kicking the bucket, biting the dust, buying the farm, and, of course, eternal sleep.

While death may be one of life’s only certainties, most of us are woefully unprepared for it. In Grave Matters, hosts Anthony Levin and Nadine J. Cohen explore grief, death care and the business of dying, asking experts the questions we’re all too scared to ask. In the first season, listeners heard from a forensic scientist, a First Nations grief counselor, a Muslim death doula, a tech innovator, a funeral director, and other inspiring, passionate people whose life's work is helping listeners to better navigate death. Lift your spirits with Grave Matters: a lively look at death.

 Why cover this unique subject matter?

The co-hosts, Anthony Levin and Nadine J. Cohen, respond: "As the grandchildren of Holocaust survivors, death has been a constant in both our lives, almost since birth. It is a subject that has, in many ways, defined our long-term friendship, whether comforting each other over lost loved ones or coming up in existential, philosophical, or spiritual discussions." 

"We are comfortable with death, and we want to show people that there’s great benefit, even joy, in talking openly about death and in exploring death-related innovations and the people working at the coalface. Nadine had wanted to do a podcast exploring this very broad topic for a long time, and Anthony jumped on board before she started pitching it to networks."

The co-hosts are Anthony Levin, who is an award-winning writer, broadcaster and human rights lawyer with nearly two decades of multimedia experience. His writing has appeared in journals, books and print media including Men’s Style, The Punch (News Corp), VIVA Magazine, and Prospect Magazine (UK). He is also a skilled public speaker and moderator with a decade of experience facilitating public discussions, and in 2024, he was a Finalist for Government Lawyer of the Year. Anthony has acted in and written comedy for stage, film and TV, and has also been featured on TV & radio programs such as ABC Breakfast with Fran Kelly, Science Friction with Natasha Mitchell, and ABC’s Compass program Faith & Funerals. Grave Matters is his first foray into podcasts.

Nadine J. Cohen is a Sydney-based writer across media, screen and literature, with bylines in The Guardian, The Saturday Paper, SMH/Age, ABC, Harper's Bazaar, and more. Her debut novel, Everyone and Everything, was released to critical acclaim in 2023, and Cohen is also a passionate independent advocate for refugees affected by Australia's offshore detention program.

Nadine and Anthony share: "While we’d both been a guest on other podcasts, neither of us had podcast of us had hosting experience before embarking on this journey."

In the first season, the Good Grief episode on March 12th was one of my favorites because a psychologist and grief counselor discussed rituals around the world to deal with grief, and how we can develop our own personal grief rituals. In the episode, co-host Nadine Cohen discusses keeping relics from loved ones who have passed, like, in her case, an ugly coffee mug from her late mother. Then psychologist Dr. Paul Martin talks about public rituals about death, citing the Japanese three-day festival of Obon, or Bon, is a Buddhist holiday that honors ancestors and the dead. It involves cleaning graves, making offerings, and lighting lanterns. 

The May 14th episode -- Saying Furr-well -- discussed how the death of our pets is just as impactful as the death of human loved ones. The two guests discuss palliative care for dying pets, and how human owners can, and should, take the time to learn what pain means to a sick pet and how they can help them. As the episode emphasizes, people often underestimate the grief that flows from the death of a pet -- dog, cat, hamster, horses, and birds.

 
The podcast began in March 2024 and ended its season in May, and a second season began in October. The first season began with a show on organ donation. The key questions were:What happens to the bodies that do end up in labs? And what if there’s a shortage? 

So far, the second season episodes have been strong. For example, members of the LGBTQI community face unique, often invisible challenges when it comes to aging and dying. They are also creating new and joyful ways to celebrate and honor each other’s lives. One man is holding their hands through it all. Anthony and Nadine chat with LGBTQI advocate Russ Gluyas about death and dying in the Queer community.

In another episode, the co-hosts asked two essential questions: Do we have a fundamental right to die? Should everyone have access to Voluntary Assisted Dying (VAD)? Episode Guest Dr Philip Nitschke has been at the forefront of VAD advocacy and innovation for 30 years. He joined Anthony and Nadine to discuss the legal and ethical questions surrounding dying with dignity.

 I loved their episode on zombies and vampires. For centuries, undead creatures have been used to represent social anxieties, reflect political upheaval and reinforce burial rites. Anthony and Nadine met a scholar who says the undead aren’t really monsters at all - they’re us. What can the walking corpse or the bloodsucking temptress tell us about ourselves and our relationship with death and the afterlife? And can zombies ever be hot? Listen at your own risk.

Their first November show asked if listeners ever wondered who has to clean up after a murder. Or who to call about a relative’s hoarding? After 25 years of mopping up such messes, one forensic and trauma cleaner, the guest has seen it all. And from prison cells to blood-soaked parks, she may be right.

The show itself is neatly crafted and formatted. For example, each episode begins with teaser clips, then intro music, and then the show. That format captures listeners' attention right away and frames the episode for listeners.

The co-hosts also offer a content warning at the start of each episode that death will be discussed. That seems prudent and appropriate.

 

 When we asked the co-hosts about the tenor of audience feedback, they explained: "Audience feedback has been consistently positive and appreciative to hearing death and death rituals spoken about so openly and expansively."

We asked if there were any rules on how to handle discussions on death. Are there things you will not cover?  

 

Nadine Cohen responded: "There are no rules, per se, but we are hyper-aware that our use of humor is not necessarily appropriate when discussing certain topics and anecdotes, with and without guests. The only things we avoid covering are topics that we feel have been done to death (sorry)."

Check out Grave Matters and encounter the ways in which we can better prepare for our death and for the death of loved ones. 

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For more podcast reporting, check out Ear Worthy on Forbes magazine.

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